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dogsbreath
P Plater
10 Posts
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 Posted - 10 Apr 2009 : 10:18:40 PM
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Hi there,my first post here,and i say hi.
My vn v6 is using a fair bit of oil,especially after highway driving,not sure how many klm its done,as speddo is stuck on 245000klm..
I want to either rebuild it to high performance specs,but at same time,still be my daily driving vehicle.......Do i rebuild my engine,or purchase another one from the wreckers,and get mechanic to rebuild that for me,that way,i can get new engine rebuilt over time,and still be able to drive my car.....Either way,was hoping someone here can reccomend a engine builder in melbourne sth east subs,and wat costs would i be looking at for a very mild engine,something that will give me 13 to 13.5 secs over quarter.......I will be getting a auto built with stalli,shift kit etc to match the engine,but motor will be first......All info appreciated......
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Blacky
P Plater
45 Posts
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Posted - 10 Apr 2009 : 11:25:24 PM
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| Hey mate, in my opinion buy another motor and get it built, so your car doesnt have to to be off the road and just incase something came up that you didnt plan for like say a cracked head etc and depending on your budget anything could come up that could delay the motor build time. If you have the money stroke it or look at forced induction of some sought either turbo/supercharging |
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leebo
Fully Licenced
495 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 11:04:32 AM
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Remember you motor in the car is not abnormal by burning lot's of oil even the Buick 3800 ECOTEC still did it etc.
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I'll show you the Rick James cell. It's superfreaky!. |
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dogsbreath
P Plater
10 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 1:12:42 PM
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Thanks for the replys,think ill be looking around for another engine and tranny,and do the rebuild over a few months....Is there anywhere i can find what size parts and gear i need,to get my spare room looking like a speed shop.....Will purchase all the parts,and then start to get block ready for rebuild.........So im still looking for a highly reccomended engine builder in sth east melb........
Cheers......... |
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crazybiker
Fully Licenced
141 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 3:28:53 PM
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Well first, a 13-13.5 Second Buick V6 1/4 run isn't mild :p
What kind of power mark you looking for?
How street friendly do you want it?
I'd PERSONALLY build up a second motor, and do an engine swap when the new ones finished. (I *NEED* my car. I'm always going out)
Again, personally, I'd build the motor myself (Just because I hate paying people for doing stuff I can do).
The what parts and size, all depends on exactly what you want.
Give me a few ideas, and I can run it through an engine simulator to give your rough outputs. |
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dogsbreath
P Plater
10 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 4:02:11 PM
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| To keep it short and sharp,i had a vk,308,around 350hp,street driven,fun to drive....Something along the line of that would do,im a v8 person from years back,so the v6 thingo is new to me,can i get the v6 rockin and rollin at idle with a good cam,like my 308 did????.......Will the rummble be similar??......Im sure you know along the lines what i am after,a v6 that sounds lumpy,and has fair bit of balls......Obviously head work,cam,pistons,rings,crank and so on,so just need some good old v6 advice on achiving some hp along this line....Will get the auto built to suit engine,was looking at a 2500stall,shift kit etc...So whats the specs with the engine you suggest........Will get to the auto after ive sorted all my engine parts....Hope to have all parts in next few weeks if i can find what i need here,if not,a trip to the local engine builder for some advice....Thanks again boys.... |
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crazybiker
Fully Licenced
141 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 5:42:07 PM
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Can you get the V6 running as lumpy as a your 308? Yes. With an agressive cam, that should get your Idle vacuum considerably lower.
Will the rumble be similar? Probably not. You're missing 2 cylinders :P
What would I suggest? What's your budget? |
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leebo
Fully Licenced
495 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 6:10:14 PM
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There's two ways you can go about it really one being a short motor rebuilt being just the motor and in it goes.
Or long motor being the motor and everything attached to it, power steering, ultinator, radiator etc absolutely everything under the bonnet but of course costs more.
all depend what you wana spend. |
I'll show you the Rick James cell. It's superfreaky!. |
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crazybiker
Fully Licenced
141 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 6:12:34 PM
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Not necessary to do those things.
At most, maybe the radiator.
Power Steering is perfectly fine normally.
Alternator supplies sufficient amount of power. They have a maximum output of 85 Amps. |
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dogsbreath
P Plater
10 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 6:58:08 PM
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i will be willing to go between $3000 to $4000 in parts,headwork,block work,and assembly.......Installing if extra is sweet.......Then auto on top of that.....
Cheers...... |
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crazybiker
Fully Licenced
141 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 7:25:12 PM
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You'd be best for that much to probably just get a good supercharger kit with an intercooler.
Well, you can never be 100% accurate, but I simulated a standard motor with Extractors, high flow 2.5" Exhaust.
Supercharger with 12PSI. Peak Torque 302ft/lb~408NM @ 4750. Peak Power 287hp~214kw @ 5000.
That's the graph.
That's using 90RON fuel. It could be fine tuned a fair bit more with spark advance, but that has no engine knock. |
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dogsbreath
P Plater
10 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 7:30:19 PM
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| Ok,but my motor is tired i feel,and would like to rebuild one if i purchase from wrecked car...i,would like to put some extra beefy items in,while its in pieces....... |
Edited by - dogsbreath on 11 Apr 2009 7:32:28 PM |
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delcowizzid
P Plater
69 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 7:52:21 PM
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ok ill play the game best bet slap some new rings and bearings in it and some gaskets and valve stem seals forget everything else well maybe a cam to suit boost.slap on a turbo or charger and have some fun i have pics too but i cant upload will go host 1 somewhere this would be ok setup
 or just go buy a second hand runner from the wreckers or on ebay my mate is running a $57 engine with 16psi daily as his regular car no issues |
delco tuner and hacker |
Edited by - delcowizzid on 11 Apr 2009 7:59:32 PM |
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crazybiker
Fully Licenced
141 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 7:59:01 PM
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| Would you be able to do that 4 grand though? |
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delcowizzid
P Plater
69 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 8:01:03 PM
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| easy to do that with 4 grand. |
delco tuner and hacker |
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crazybiker
Fully Licenced
141 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 8:16:58 PM
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I'm guessing you threw in some wear on the motor in those graphs?
I did a run with slightly reduced valve lift and reduced compression, but there's no point in me posting mine if yours is VERY similar. |
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delcowizzid
P Plater
69 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 8:27:35 PM
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| thats 350 Hp at 10 psi you can run 20 on these engines with good headgaskets and some new headstuds.that was a vortech T-trim blower too and a wade cam.i couldnt be bothered making the changes for turbo just a quick jobby i had made for someone elses brandnew engine. go here and see the $57 engine powered commi http://delcohacking.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=45 check out clints VN S1 only requires 1 exhaust manifold to be made uses the stock drivers side one nice easy setup does 14's with slipping clutch and no traction definatly a 13 second car very soon.some of yous would of seen it in streetcommodores last month or 2 at the drags. |
delco tuner and hacker |
Edited by - delcowizzid on 11 Apr 2009 8:29:26 PM |
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crazybiker
Fully Licenced
141 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 8:30:27 PM
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Interesting.
Do you happen to have an MSN?
I'm interested in talking to you about a few things |
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delcowizzid
P Plater
69 Posts
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Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 8:40:51 PM
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| i PM's my messenger username mate and sent a contact request to your one listed in your profile |
delco tuner and hacker |
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VN91SX
Fully Licenced
344 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 10:18:07 AM
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A budget of $3000-4000 on all that work and a cam. My cam package set me back $3700. Cam is a big job. Its more than just replacing the cam and getting a sh1tty chip with a tune on it that you know nothing about. Just take a look at page 121 of this months addition of Street Commodores. Have a look at that sad as power curve that some jurk off put on this V8. In seeing this though, i must say that my before cam work dyno curve was very smooth, and that was with a $120 ebay chip. New dyno curve isn't too bad (very smooth with a Microtech ecu) making 120kw at the wheels, and mate she sounds awesome. Everyone says it sounds like a V8.
The point is, to make big power with the V6 and keeping it N/A is an expensive exercise. New parts and quality workmanship don't come cheap (shame to say). $5000 will get a full supercharger kit and plenty of power under your right foot. Add to that a shift kit and decent brakes and it aint cheap. That option could cost up to $10000 if you buy all new parts. |
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crazybiker
Fully Licenced
141 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 11:07:53 AM
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| The biggest thing holding back the Buick V6 is the flow of the heads. |
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dogsbreath
P Plater
10 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 11:54:54 AM
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| Just had some good news today,looks like ill be purchasing a burnt out vn,and getting running gear from it.....tyres,bumpers were burnt in fire,everything else fine,body is bit rough,car was in shed fire,it did not catch fire itself,,so ill swap everthing over....Not clear on all the running gear,but what i can tell,is its a v6,supercharged,extensive work done to engine,done 20,000klm,has 5 spd strengthen box,3.9 mini spooled rear end.......Featured in some issues of car mag few years back,and was easternats 06......will get the springs from it too,and what ever else i can grab....Will be selling the 5spd though,as i rather auto.......Will know more on wednesday after i actually sight the car........Getting the whole car for very good price........ |
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crazybiker
Fully Licenced
141 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 12:47:41 PM
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Keep the gearbox man.
Especially if it's strengthened. You don't need to use the T5, just keep it.
Plus, manuals are more fun to play with. |
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delcowizzid
P Plater
69 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 4:45:44 PM
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| you can get a cam reground for under $300 its only when you get sucked in and buy a brandnew cam and a crap tune that comes with it for big dollars cause of the name on it crowcams etc even just a new tune on the v6 wakes them up a lot. |
delco tuner and hacker |
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VN91SX
Fully Licenced
344 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 6:21:00 PM
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What are you trying to say delcowizzid? I just feel that your last post is directed at me. I wouldn't say that the work that i just had done to my car is crap. The tune is spot on, far better than the chip i got off ebay. Now i dont have the engine destroying problem called running lean that i had when i trusted some bodgey chump of ebay to regulate my fuel maps. The motor is now throwing out as much power as the V8 that was in the VP clubsport when it was released.
Are you making referrence to the chip and cam packages?
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delcowizzid
P Plater
69 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 6:43:32 PM
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| wasnt having a dig at anyone just saying that there are far cheaper ways of getting a good cam without paying big bucks for one and get just the same results as the expensive cam packages with chips on offer.it was a reply to your post but not a go at you mate.i build complete engines with cams etc for less than the price of your cam package you bought. |
delco tuner and hacker |
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VN91SX
Fully Licenced
344 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 8:17:38 PM
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| Thanks for clearing that up delcowizzid, and i don't mean that in an aggressive way either mate. They know how to charge you an arm and a leg, i know that, but they did a great job. They have a skill set that i don't have, so i was willing to pay for their skill set because they have the runs on the board. What i find rediculous is the price of a strocker kit for the 3800. It is close to twice the price of the 308 kit grrrr! |
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leebo
Fully Licenced
495 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 8:34:06 PM
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Hey do they have different stage cam packages such as VN91SX stage 3 crow cams etc. They are expensive but worth it at the same time.
Delcowizzid you said that you can do cams for $300 what does that mean is that like a stage 1 or something lumpy cam i think they call it?
VN91SX has gona for the brand spanker new cams but can you pick them up cheap as a replacement much like yella terra rockers etc? |
I'll show you the Rick James cell. It's superfreaky!. |
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delcowizzid
P Plater
69 Posts
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Posted - 12 Apr 2009 : 10:47:07 PM
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| for $300 you can get any grind you want pretty much if you want to go too wild some places will tell you the lobes are to far away from each other to go that wild but it would be pretty lump by the time you get that far.the wade 992 is a good cam for v6 and very similar to the ZZP Performance cam from the US.ZZP suggest twin pipes and extractors and a high stall with theres but say it will go ok without the stall.most good cam grinders have all the other camshaft manufacturers specs that they can grind onto your old camshaft for under $300. |
delco tuner and hacker |
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Blacky
P Plater
45 Posts
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Posted - 13 Apr 2009 : 08:36:14 AM
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| Soz Dogsbreath for taking over your thread, but delcowizzid the missus wants to start drag racing and wants to start in a vn so she feels comfortable, but then upgrade, so what could i do for just for just $1500 to get her started? do you, your self have any packages? |
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VN91SX
Fully Licenced
344 Posts
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Posted - 13 Apr 2009 : 11:38:22 AM
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| By the time you do it properly, you will be getting up toward the mark that i spent, that i can guarantee you. There is no such thing as cheap horsepower, only cheap mechanical failure. I don't believe in creating all this power, cutting corners, and then waiting for those corners that i cut to break before replacing them. A cam upgrade requires more than just a bigger cam, and a generic chip. I went on the advice of two performance workshops that have the runs on the board when it comes to performance mechanical egineering with multiple cars running below the 10 second mark for a 1/4 mile. My car isn't going to run those times, but i will go on their mechanical know how any day of the week, even if it means paying more money. |
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